Thursday, May 31, 2012

Can The Mormon Church, Help President Obama Prove His American Indian Ancestry?

In Dreams, p. 13 Mr Obama says that "a distant ancestor" of hers "had indeed been a full-blooded Cherokee". No evidence has been found to support this claim***.

Madelyne Payne Dunham's roots, mother Leona (McCurry) Payne/Margaret Bell Wright/Frances A Allred/ Anna Bunch*

The Bunch were part of the Melungeon DNA study. They came back with the Eb1a1 halo type "Sub Saharan African".  The Bunch YDNA Project. Scroll down the page to read about President Obama's Bunch ancestors YDNA findings. 

"Now a new DNA study in the Journal of Genetic Genealogy attempts to separate truth from oral tradition and wishful thinking. The study found the truth to be somewhat less exotic: Genetic evidence shows that the families historically called Melungeons are the offspring of sub- Saharan African men and white women of northern or central European origin. 

There were a whole lot of people upset by this study, "lead researcher Roberta Estes said. "They just knew they were Portuguese or Native American".

I addressed the American Indian components to the Melungeon in my last post: Melungeon DNA Study Findings, Wipes Out President Obama's Cherokee Ancestry. I am going to address the Portuguese component. 

This Melungeon DNA project has been presented as something conclusive to the ethnicity of the people who were known by the slur Melungeon. The best way to describe this study is to compare it to the CBO. The Congressional Budget Office is sent bills from our congress to score the cost. The CBO can only use the numbers they are given to figure out the cost of the bill. This Melungeon study can only be scored by the DNA of the descendants of the people that were referred to by the slur Melungeon, that were included in the study. 

The study finds that the people called Melungeon were the offspring of sub- Saharan African men, and white woman of European origin. Because they found Eb1a1 halo type?  That does not mean they weren't Portuguese. The Portuguese were involved in the slave trade, Angola, West Africa was a Portuguese colony for 400 years. If you were from Angola, up until 1975 you were a Portuguese citizen. Not unlike how Kenya was a British colony, and you would be a British citizen. 

They also called themselves Black Dutch. The meaning of Black Dutch has changed over time to mean an ethnic display, but I believe it originally was meant to describe origins of people effected by the Dutch participation in the Black slave trade. These people knew how they entered colonial America. 

Halo Group Eb1a1 (YDNA) it was known as E3a from 2002 -2008.  I don't want to bore people with the DNA.  Here is a link to Bantu expansion and Bantu migration, it includes a visual aid a map graphic - it shows migration into Angola and other African Countries. 

Why would finding Eb1a1 halo group in the Melungeon DNA study prove the Melungeon were not Portuguese. JOGG expects us to believe that Portugal was ruling Angola for 400 years and no mixing occurred between Portuguese and the Indigenous tribes of Angola? Even if they didn't mix with them, calling themselves Portygee is still correct, Angola was a Portuguese colony.

Portugal was involved in the slave trade as were the Dutch. Portugal, Angola, Brazil to Virginia. The Portuguese were also shipping African slaves into Mexico to work in the mines. 

Those Africans, probably no more than 150-200, taken from the Bautista by 
English corsairs, were among the thousands captured in the Portuguese-Ndongo 
war of 1618-1619 described in an earlier chapter by Thornton. Sluiter points 
out that the Bautista... 

"...was the only slave ship among the 36 named as arriving at Vera Cruz 
during the fiscal years 1618-1619 through 1621-22 to be attacked inbound from 
Angola, by corsairs."

 The Angolans, the first African-American forefathers in a British-American 
colony, the first of the African ancestors of the Melungeons, came ashore at 
Point Comfort that day from the man-o-war "White Lion", commanded by Captain 
John Colyn Jope of Cornwall, England, sailing out of Vlissingen, the 
Netherlands. Jope traded the "20, and Odd" Africans to Virginia governor 
George Yeardley and Cape merchant Abraham Piersey in exchange for provisions. 

Then these names began to appear on records in colonial Virginia, Rodrigues - became Driggers, Francisco became Sisco and Cisco, Goynes -Goins, Chavis - Chavez. My own Gibson family line goes back to Chavis we had a history with the Driggers

As far as mixing with Indians, tell it to the Gingaskin tribe of Virginia they lost their tribal designation for not being "Indian" enough. 

I think I have shown that Eb1a1 halo type doesn't signify a person can't be Portuguese. 

"It's sometimes embarrassing to see the lengths your ancestors went to hide their African heritage, but look at the consequences said "Wayne Winkler" past president of the Melungeon Heritage Association. "They suffered anyway because of the suspicion."

Or they were telling the truth, and other people's bias are still being projected onto them, apparently now it's coming from their own descendants. 

Melungeon identity is assumed to involve a mixture of some combination of Western European, Native American, and sometimes African ancestry, with early assertions of "Portuguese" or "Portuguese Indian" background being widely claimed. The term "tri racial isolate" has been academically applied to this group, but this term is problematic in that not all Melungeons claim a tri-racial identity and, in many cases, these families appear to be anything but isolates. 

Some of the most prominent surnames that have been claimed as potentially associated with Melungeon identity include, Bowling (Bolin), Bunch*, Chavis (Chavez), Collins, Epps, Evans, Fields, Francisco, Gibson, Gill, Goins, Goodman, Minor, Mise, Moore, Mullins, Osborn(e), Phipps, Reeves, (Rives,Rieves, Reeves,Reaves), Ridley (Riddle),Rodrigues, Stowers, Vanover, Williams, and Wise. This extremely partial list should not be taken as suggesting, however, that every family using this surname is necessarily considered to be Melungeon.

Some of the sources and discussions pertaining to the Melungeons suggest that, in some cases, there may be a relationship to a specific Native American group. One of those groups that figures prominently consists of those generally defined as Saponi. End

I don't know if the President is upset by the Melungeon YDNA study findings, as the Huffington Post headline suggest, people would be upset to find they didn't have Portuguese or American Indian ancestry. 

I believe that the President of the United States knows his ethnic makeup, JOGG's cherry picked Melungeon YDNA study aside.   My first hint that he knew where he came from, his comments on "The View" that upset a lot of people when he said: We are sort of a mongrel people. 

Barbara Walters offered this comment and question to President Obama: You do not describe yourself as a black president. Your mother was white. Would it be helpful or why don't you say "I'm not a black president, I'm bi-racial?"

Obama responded, in part: The interesting thing about the African-American experience in this country is that we are sort of a mongrel people, I mean we're all kinds of mixed-up. Now that's actually true for white America as well, but we just know more about it."

Oh I don't know about that knowing more about it Mr President, some of us have a pretty good handle on our pedigree ;)

Stay tuned next we are going to explore Vardy Collins R1a1a  "Viking Blood".  Vardy Collins was such a famous Melungeon character, they named a town after him Vardy, Hancock Co.,Tennessee.  When people would ask for directions to Sneedville, they would be told: You can't there from here. 

Monday, May 28, 2012

Melungeon DNA Study Findings, Wipes Out President Obama's Cherokee Ancestry


Ms. Warren's claims are current and well known, but President Obama's claims were made back in 1995, when his memoir, Dreams from My Father, was published. On pages 12 and 13 of the 2004 paperback edition, the President unequivocally asserts his Cherokee ancestry:
If asked, Toot [Obama’s maternal grandmother, Madelyne Payne Dunham] would turn her head in profile to show off her beaked nose, which, along with a pair of jet-black eyes, was offered as proof of Cherokee blood.
But an old, sepia toned photograph on the bookshelf spoke most eloquently of their [grandparents Stanley and Madelyne Dunham’s] roots.  It showed Toot’s grandparents, of Scottish and English stock, standing in front of a ramshackle homestead, unsmiling and dressed in coarse wool, their eyes squinting at the sun baked flinty life that stretched before them…in their eyes one could see truths that I would have to learn later as facts…that while one of my great-great grandfathers, Christopher Columbus Clark, had been a decorated Union soldier, his wife’s mother was rumored to have been a second cousin of Jefferson Davis…that although another distant ancestor had indeed been a full-blooded Cherokee, such lineage was a source of shame to Toot’s mother [Leona McCurry Payne] who blanched whenever someone mentioned the subject and hoped to carry the secret to her grave. END

15 -- For some of her ancestry, see

In Dreams, p. 13, Mr. Obama says that "a distant ancestor" of hers "had indeed been a full-blooded Cherokee". No evidence has been found to support this claim***.

At the end of the 19th century, her paternal grandparents lived in the Chickasaw Nation in what is now Oklahoma, but in the census enumeration (see above) they are listed as "White", not as "Indian". END

Indeed Leona (McCurry) Payne, probably knew where the subject of that very Cherokee ancestry would lead, back to the "Melungeon" Leona (McCurry) Payne/Margaret Belle Wright/Frances A Allred/ Anna Bunch.

Melungeon DNA Study Reveals Ancestry Upset's "A Whole Lot Of People" Huffington Post, By TRAVIS LOLLER 05/24/12 05:15 PM ET AP

Now a new DNA study in the Journal of Genetic Genealogy attempts to separate truth from oral tradition and wishful thinking. The study found the truth to be somewhat less exotic: Genetic evidence shows that the families historically called Melungeons are the offspring of sub-Saharan African men and white women of northern or central European origin.

"There were a whole lot of people upset by this study," lead researcher Roberta Estes said. "They just knew they were Portuguese, or Native American." Keep Reading HERE.

For the record, it's no secret what makes up the ethnicity of people who were referred to by the slur Melungeon, White, Black and Indian.  Verry Slitly Mixt - Tri Racial Isolates Of The Upper South A Genealogical Study 1988, By Virginia Easley DeMarce Phd.  Ms DeMarce is a historian, and has been the past President of The National Genealogical Society. 

Anna Bunch the President's grandmother "Toot's" ancestor was the daughter of Nathaniel Bunch and Sarah Wade Ray. Nathaniel Bunch son of Charles Bunch and Mary Bellamy. Charles Bunch the son of Samuel Bunch and Mary Hudson. These Bunch are mentioned in the Melungeon DNA  project. You can find the results HERE. You will notice the Bunch are at the top of the table, and carry the Eb halo type, that is mentioned in the Huffington Post article"Sub Saharan African" halo type, that is supposed to have "upset people" to find out it existed in their family genetic ancestry. Never mind that it's been known for some time the mixture of the people who were referred to by the slur Melungeon. According to Jack Goins this Melungeon DNA study proves there was no Indian component in the make up of Melungeon's he doubles downs here., that means that President Obama, has no Cherokee ancestry.

From the Bunch YDNA project
Bunch Family
The Bunch family apparently descends from John Bunch who patented 450 acres in New Kent County in 1662.  Another John Bunch, "a Mulatto," and Sarah Slayden, a white woman, petitioned the Council of Virginia in 1705 to allow them to marry because the minister of Blisland Parish (New Kent and James City counties) refused to marry them. The Attorney General was undecided whether the petition "came within the intent of the Law preventing Negros and White Persons intermarrying" because he could not resolve
Whether the issue begotten on a White woman by a Mulatto man can properly be called a Mulatto, that name I conceive being only appropriated to the Child of a Negro man begotten upon a white woman or a white man upon a negro woman, and as I am told the issue of a Mulatto by or upon a white person has another name viz. that of Mustee?
Paul Bunch patented 265 acres in present-day Halifax County, North Carolina, adjoining Gideon Gibson?s land and left a 1726 Chowan County will by which he left a considerable estate to a "Mulatto woman" Keziah Holdebee and her three children. And Samuel Bunch was indicted in the Gibson?s Mill area of Louisa County, Virginia, for failing to list a tithable which was probably his wife, but this branch of the family was considered white by the end of the colonial period as were the other branches of the family that went to South Carolina.

There is more on Barack Obama's ancestor Samuel Bunch and his "Mulatto" father John Bunch here:

The interesting thing is that some of the VA Bunch family owned slaves.
There is an African connection here since Nathaniel Bunch of Arkansas's cousin Nathaniel Bunch of Virginia requested that upon his death his slaves be freed with the option of going to Liberia. END.

The President of the United States has every reason to believe that he has Cherokee ancestry, in fact the author of the Melungeon Study, hyped by Huffington Post article, posted the family that descends from Samuel Bunch's brother David Bunch, and his descendants membership on the Cherokee  DAWES Rolls. Scroll down in the page to see the Chart. 

  • -  Cherokee DAWES applicants 19506 and 44416 (below) show John Carr Bunch as their father.   In Louisa Co VA, on 6 April, 1782, there is a Deed of Trust that shows: "Joseph Bunch Thomas Carr, Garland Carr, Nathaniel Anderson and James Minor executors of John Carr dec'd.  £357 for tract on Hudson's Creek containing 96 acres adjoining James Watson, James Bunch, Pouncey Bunch also Negro woman Vista and her child Ben. In trust Bunch to pay to legatees of John Carr dec'd.  68 1/2 ounces of gold no greater alloy than is contained in an English Guinea. sig. Joseph Bunch, wit. Turner Anderson, Robert Wilson, Wm. Hughes, Wm. Harris. Rec. 12 Aug 1782."
    • -  Ref    Book: H, Page: 203, Grantor: Joseph Bunch, Grantee: Thomas Carr, Garland Carr, Nathaniel And, Date: 06-Apr-1782


      25 Jan 1745 Louisa County, Virginia Court: William Hall, Samuel Collins, William Collins, Samuel Bunch, George Gibson, Benjamin Brannum, Thomas Gibson, & William Donothan appear to answer an indictment for concealing tithables. Plead not guilty, Case continued. (Louisa County, Va., Tithables and Census)

      Although this John Collins may, or may not be a brother to Thomas the court record below establishes that some Collins were Saponia Indians. "Alexander Machartoon, John Bowling, Manincassa, Capt Tom, Isaac, Harry, blind tom, Foolish Jack, Charles Griffin, John Collins, Little Jack, Indians being bought before the court for stealing Hogs. , Ordered that their Guns be taken away from them till they are ready to depart of this county, they having declared their intentions to depart this colony within a week.".11 On pages 309-312 of Orange County Court Record book the above named men individually put up security.11

There are two well known Melungeon figures who lived on Newmans Ridge, who were documented to have been called  by the Slur Melungeon,  Vardy Collins and Shephard "Buck" Gibson.  They are included in the Melungeon DNA study, none of their descendants carry Eb "Sub Sarharan African" halo type.

Collins YDNA project

C-5 52337 Vardeman Collins R1a1a 

R1a halo type, the fabled halo group R1a -or precisely it's subclade R1a1- is said to indicate "Viking Origin" when it is found among men of British descent. Viking DNA among the Border Reivers.  

Gibson YDNA project

G-75 Shephard "Old Buck" Gibson born 1765 Va died 1842 Tn. R1b1a2

Descendants of both documented Melungeon men who lived on Newsman Ridge, participated in the Melungeon Core YDNA study.

The family of David Collins and Thompsy Posting match the DNA participants of Vardy Collins.  These Collins are "Saponi"  Since David and Vardy Collins DNA match,  it stands to reason that Vardy Collins was also of Saponi descent.  David Collins daughter Eleanor Collins married John Turnbull/Bull the Turnbulls is a well known Border Reiver surname. 

Other well known Border Reiver surname Rutherford .  Griffth Rutherford brigadier general of Salisbury district militia forced the Cherokee into a treaty in North Carolina during the Revolutionary War. April 1779 Rutherford Co., North Carolina is named after General Griffth Rutherford.  The people who settled Rutherford Co.,North Carolina were of Scot -Irish descent. 

My cousin that descends from Isaac Gibson Sr., the same ancestor that was enumerated as FPC on the 1830  Knox Co.,Ky., census, and a land holder also matches Shepherd "Old Buck" Gibson YDNA of Newmans Ridge.  These families migrated from Louisa Co.,Va., as did President Obama's Bunch family. In fact the President's ancestor Charles Bunch son of Samuel Bunch, and Mary Hudson and father of Nathaniel Bunch who married Sarah Wade Ray,  is found on a petition on Grainger Co.,Tn.,  The same petition as my ancestors 5th Great Grandfather David Campbell, and 5th Great Grandfather John Jones - husband of Orpha Gibson. Isaac Gibson Sr., also signed the same petition. 

19-1-1799 Petition of citizens of Grainger "concerning that it will not be to the advantage of the Publick at Large to add any part of Grainger county to Jefferson........."

G-135 Isaac Gibson born circa 176o/5 North Carolina died 1837 Knox Co.,Ky. R1b1a2

Isaac Gibson Sr's family intermarried with the above David Collins family. Many of my cousins are both Gibsons and Collins, we have the Mason family as our common ancestor.

I am not sure why the heavy dependence on DNA in genealogy research? Especially without the caveats of what DNA testing can prove and not prove. I know there is big money in DNA testing so it's promoted as an essential tool. 

While DNA can prove direct ancestry or linage, it can't prove race or ethnicity. The reason for this is that human beings are so much alike, and have had genetic mixtures for so long even the most defining racial or ethnic traits are found in almost every human family. Skin color, facial structure, hair and eye color, all things that are use to define race or ethnicity lose definition when traced as part of a DNA analyst. There is no gene that can accurately define an American Indian for instance, because many of the so-called defining characteristics are genetically identical to many Asians and African Americans.

For the record, I disagree with Roberta Estes above about the ethnic make up of Melungeon people. I  looked at President Barack H Obama's grandmother "Toots" ancestry, I do believe the family has Cherokee ancestry through the Bunch family. Considering some of the President's distant Bunch cousins made it onto the Cherokee DAWES Rolls so does the Cherokee Nation. 

Since we are all cousins, according to the Melungeon YDNA study - "It was such a closely related group that it is conjectured that everyone that descends from everyone, and therefore from all the founders".  I would like to ask cousin Barry to update his Collins and Gibson kin, on what's the hold up with the Reparations, and why is our tribe under attack by FTDNA denying our American Indian ancestry ;)

For further reading on the Virginia Tribes on going struggle for tribal recognition.  SEE the Black and White World of Walter Ashby Plecker. 

And this is how you remind me...... this is how you remind me of what I really am..... this is how you remind me of what I really am.....It's not like you to say sorry, I was waiting on a different story, this time I'm mistaken. These five words in my head scream "Are We Having Fun Yet" This is how you remind me of what I really am...... Cornbread Red, Pickin on Nickleback, This is how you remind me of what I really am.....  Are We Having Fun Yet?